Long story, but some years ago, I took home from an AGM a vintage 0-4-0 tram engine of (shall we say) freelance appearance in poor condition. It was missing its clockwork mechanism, the wooden bodywork was damaged, it was much too tall and had somewhat spindly wheels. I think of her as 'Orphan Annie' (e.g. who had to be found a home).
I did think about trying to restore her but concluded there was so much missing it wasn't worth it but that she might form the basis of a new engine. I looked around for a suitable prototype but there was nothing that really fitted the main dimensions apart from a 22 ton LYR accumulator shunting engine mentioned by Henry Greenley. The problem was that all my searches for LYR electric engines only found two that clearly were not the HG engine (a converted 2-4-2 steam loco and a steeple cab).
Then the other day I stumbled over this (whilst searching for some thing completely different of course!);
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Battery-electric_locomotive,_Lancashire_%26_Yorkshire_railway_(Rankin_Kennedy,_Electrical_Installations,_Vol_III,_1903).jpg
I recognised the engine instantly as being the one referred to by HG. Tweedales & Smalley were a textile machinery manufacturer in Castleton and this engine was presumably used by them to shunt their sidings. However I have been unable to find any other reference to this engine. Nothing, not even the company that built it (I'm assuming it was not T&S). However my LYR references are very limited so I don't know if this engine is extremely obscure or is widely known about?
So I wonder if the collective wisdom & knowledge of this Forum can point me in the right direction?
Hello All
Afraid to say near enough home ground and never had a snif of it . The best I can say is try L & Y society and Industrial Railway Society
John
Ian,
As probably the only L&Y Society member on the Forum, I have taken up the challenge to see what I can find. The loco you refer to is certainly not an LYR loco, but I assume was privately owned by Tweedales & Smalley who's work's private sidings were connected to the L&Y (by agreement made on 12 Dec 1891) at Castleton. Though the works were on the down side just north (Rochdale end) of Castleton station the connection was a trailing one to the up line just before the platform opposite Castleton Signal Box. (ref. "The Oldham Loop part 2" by J Wells, No.42 pt2 in Foxline's 'Scenes from the Past' series).
From a quick search of the web I came across "Industrial Locomotives for Mining, Factory and allied uses - Part III Electric Locos" (http://users.tinyworld.co.uk/ainskip/ThievesBridge/PartIII.html) fig. 45 which shows a photo and gives a description of a 4whl electric loco built by Mather & Platt for Tweedales & Smalley - I assume this is the loco you are referring to, a box on wheels!
But if you would like a very small 4whl LYR loco and the steeple cab (LYR #2) of Clifton Power Station is too big (21ft 11' over buffers with 9ft wheelbase) then how about one of the 3 Simplex petrol engined shunters that were supplied to the L&Y in 1919/20 by Motor Rail & Tramcar Co. of Bedford. There was an article on these in Backtrack by Andrew B. Mould - not sure which one as I only have the removed pages (210-213), which do not indicate the volume; or you could wait until G3 Society member Barry Lane's book on LYR locos is hopefully finally published at the end of the month.
Regards,
Derek.
Thanks for replying guys,
I will contact the Industrial Railway Society I think - as this was a privately owned engine.
I'd already seen the "box on wheels" that you are refering to Derek (it's almost a wagon with overhead wiring bolted on - pretty Heath Robinson) but if you look at the link I provided, you will see that this T&S locomotive was an altogether more elegant bit of engineering. Since it was in a book published in 1903 - that begins to date it and also since Henry Greenly mentions it, it cannot have been completely unknown at the time.
Anyway - thank you again for responding - it was worth asking.
Regards,
Ian T
Yes Ian, I should have looked at the link you provided first!! Rather an interesting looking engine, which should not be that difficult to model if you can get some details and dimensions. If you have access to the "Oldham Loop" book mentioned previously there is a period photo of Tweedales & Smalley works at the top of page 50 where you can just make out the loco in question in the sidings.
Though I am sure there will be someone within the LYR Society who has an interest in the Industry around Castleton, unfortunately because they do not have a 'forum' I have no easy way to pass your request on. So as you say probably the Industrial Railway Society is your best option. Will be interested to hear how you get on.
Derek.
Hello Ian & All
To cut a long story short as they say . I went to the tramway modeling do at Manchester today , and got talking to some gentelmen from The Electric Railway Society and brought up the loco you are discusing and they said contact our secretary Dr I.D.O. Frew on iwfrew@tiscali.co.uk . I hope this helps .
John
Thank you John, that was very kind of you.
I will email Dr Frew as suggested.
Regards,
Ian
P.S. I discovered a key dimension of this loco last week - the wheels are 43" diameter. I'll start a new thread to explain further.