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Electric boiler feed pump?

Started by John Candy, Sep 06 2009 10:39

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John Candy

Happened to be browsing through messages on www.mylargescale.com (a US site/forum) and came across reference to a radio-controlled, servo-powered electric feed pump by the German manufacturer 'Regner' which is sold as an accessory (they also sell boilers).

Still 'dithering' over the GRS 2021 kit which is cluttering up a corner, I am wondering whether, with all that space in the panniers, it might be worthwhile adding a water tank and electric pump (rather than axle-driven pump and injectors/clack valves).

Anyone come across a Regner loco with this type of feed?

John.
My fellow Members, ask not what your Society can do for you, ask what you can do for your Society.

IanT

An interesting topic John and one where I can offer no practical experience at all - although I do have some thoughts of course! :-)

I am fairly sure this area has been explored elsewhere (I cannot find the articles just at the moment though) in G1 circles. From memory it was linked to an electronic 'water gauge' such that the pump cut in as required by a fall 'below gauge point'. So this raises in my mind the rationale of having a remotely controlled water pump - if you have no way of gauging water levels?

I will try to find the electronic water gauge article(s) if you are interested.

Regards,   Ian
Nothing's ever Easy - At least the first time around.

John Candy

Thanks Ian.

I have seen an electronic water level gauge kit in one of the catalogues (cannot remember which off hand) which lights a red bulb/LED when the water need topping up. From memory, it works optically, using the level in the gauge glass.
I suppose one could harness the output from the sensor via a small electronic circuit to switch an electric pump.
At the moment the boiler lacks a gauge glass so I would have to cross that bridge first.

Regards,
John.
My fellow Members, ask not what your Society can do for you, ask what you can do for your Society.

IanT

I've had a chance to find the article that I had in mind John. It was in the G1MRA Newsletter (Issue 206 - Summer 2005). It was by Alan Coombe and involved a single water level probe and some fairly simple electronics (an LM393 IC chip, 2 LEDs and 5 resistors) on a piece of 7x9 'hole' Veroboard.

He was originally going to use a two probe system "to drive an electric feed pump for the 14XX" he was building. But after seeing some discussion on the G1MRA Yahoo site - he tried the single probe system instead which "appears to work very well" - but seems to have used it to light a red/green hi-intensity LED mounted on the back of his GWR Autocoach trailer.

I'll scan the article for your personal use if you are interested - but remember you still need an access point to the boiler at the 'low water point' level for the probe to screw into.   

Regards,

Ian T
Nothing's ever Easy - At least the first time around.

Doddy

Has anybody developed or used a commercial electric feed water pump controlled by such a system?

I have a Velleman controller on order but lack the electric feed pump to go with it.

MTIA

Robert
"You don't know what you don't know"

AshleyW

i heard a car windscreen washer pump is powerfull enough and 12v

cabbage

I have an electric pump fitted to the Golsdorf loco. It is triggered by a LED shining through the water gauge to a LDR. The water had a green dye to absorb the red LED light.

Regards

Ralph

John Branch

I'm fairly sure that the G1MRA mag article used a standard model aircraft servo with the electronics removed, and  driving the pump using a standard eccentric crank.  How the level switch was arranged I can't remember. 
The same principle could be used in G3 I'm sure as servos come in all shapes and sizes.
Pity I threw all my old mags away.

John

AshleyW

talking of probes, fosworks do a locosaver which yes needs to go into a bush at your low water point. fosworks also sell a "fosbush" which is a self swaging backhead bush, which needs a hole drilling into the backhead and then the bush when pushed in and tightened correctly opens up like a rivet to give a steam tigh joint and voila a bush for a locosaver. now i don't know if steve was pulling my leg, but when i asked about swarf getting into the boiler when drilling the backhead, he replied, that he held the loco in the air so the swarf fell towards him and not into the loco !!! i guess you can the utilise the probe to turn the electronic feed on and off.

cabbage

Errrmmm.... Speaking as a boiler tester, I would say that fitting would require a new shell pressure test if it was a retrofit.

My pump is made from a Polly Models Eng Gauge 1 axle pump driven by a MFA Como motor and gearbox. The eccentric is +/- 5mm. I did originally think of a timer to switch on and off, but the amount of water used would be variable, so I went for simple optics.

Regards

Ralph

Doddy

WoW! Quite some interest here then! Thank you for your contributions.  8)   I have the old Dick Moger circuit diagrams which together with Peter Spoerers design (now taken on by Fosworks).

On this occasion I am going to use the Velleman Liquid Level Controller Kit #K2639 which can be integrated with my 24bit Sound Card and any relay controlled 12v/24v motor.

The input circuitry also allows either a 'wet' or 'dry' probe/level input to be configured. Namely, wet probes or temperature/light dependant resistors (NTC/LDR) and thus can be used for either a temperature or light sourced controller.

The application is for a Gauge 3 Single unit, Steam Railcar with internal length space limited available for the boiler installation which needs to be a Gas Fired, Radio Controlled unit.  So if anybody knows of a suitable Gauge 3/16mm boiler design . . . ?

Many Thanks In Advance.

Robert
"You don't know what you don't know"

Doddy

Quote from: cabbage on May 17 2021 18:48
My pump is made from a Polly Models Eng Gauge 1 axle pump driven by a MFA Como motor and gearbox.
Had a devil of a time trying to find them on Polly Models Website - eventually found them in the catalogue.



Thanks Ralph!
Robert
"You don't know what you don't know"

cabbage

Depending on your ability at silver soldering... There is the "Porcupine" boiler and the "Smithies" types that can be found in the G3 WIKI or the on line  (out of copyright) version of KN Harris "Model Boilers"...

Regards

Ralph

Doddy

I have examined the G3 WIKI site and searched for all the terms used in your last email. Without weblinks, I will not access the site again as all search terms returned 0 results.
Robert


"You don't know what you don't know"

cabbage

You have mail... I think the problem is that you tried to find specific words rather than subjects. Try the search again with "boiler".

Regards

Ralph