Bachmann's Troublesome Trucks

[MikeWilliams]

Has anyone handled one of these models and been able to measure it?

I'm told it is "G Scale", the true scale of which seems to vary somewhat.  They are for 45mm gauge but the bodies look to be quite accurate models of RCH 1923 7-plank Private Owner coal wagons with end doors - a very common type.  Even the solebars, springs and axleboxes look acceptable.  They will need at least new wheels, bearings, brakes, buffers and couplings.

BUT only if they are the correct size, which is normally 16ft 6in long.  Please does anyone have access to a sample to measure?

Oh, and they cost just £45 each, new.

Mike

[Andy B]

Dimensions quoted in this this post (#55) on gscalecentral:
http://www.gscalecentral.co.uk/f/tm.aspx?high=&m=40100&mpage=3#50454.

Wagon
250mm long over buffers (body 222mm long)
100mm wide
108mm High from rail top.

There is also discussion about Percy's suitability as a G3 std gauge loco later on page 3 of the thread, and some close-up pictures of the wagons on page 2.

Some places (on-line) are advertising the wagons at less than £40 each.

Andy

[IanT]

Some intersting posts on this link Andy;

"With the face off it looks a pretty good model. Even looks as tho the end tipple door has been modelled, if these had come along a few years ago I may have stayed UK prototype, but alas I am too far down the line now! The coaches remind me of those on the North Sunderland branch at Seahouses"

Also the coach dimensions are given as;

Coach
360mm long over buffers (body 330mm long)
108mm wide
143mm High from rail top

Mark P has already converted one of these engines and is sending the Newsletter the details. I am sure that purists will not be too interested but I think some G3 'Grandads' might be quite happy to encourage younger family engine drivers to do some 'Thomas' running on their railways.

[MikeWilliams]

So the wagons are jusy about scale length and width, and have correct body details.  Think I'll buy one and have a go!

Mike

[IanT]

I was more interested in the coach potential Mike, as at 45 pounds each (RRP) these also look pretty good value. So having a few moments before Management served dinner, I've had a quick look for something prototypical...

The best I have found (so far) are the Metropolitan Railways (four door) Jubilee carriages. I think these were 25' 9" in length, so 347mm (vs 330mm in the model) and had a very similar window arrangement apart from circular door-tops. I guess if you could modify (or ignore) this, then you would have a pretty good head start on a near-scale G3 carriage at a very reasonable cost. There were also five compartment 3rds & 3rd/brake versions but then you are into a more severe 'cut & add' operation. I was only interested in something fairly simple - like re-gauging.

I have not looked into the detail, but I believe the Met eventally sold some of these Jubilee carriages to the Mid-Suffolk (John will know more about the Middy I think.....see http://www.gauge3.org.uk/members/middytrain.jpg), the Weston, Clevedon & Portishead, the Nidd Valley and that some even ended up on the Rhymney. So they would be not look out of place on many light railways.

Can anyone find a good prototype match for a (longer) bogie carriage (using two bodies)?

[John Candy]

In addition to the link I have added into Ian's message above (providing an archive photo from c.1908), below is a photo which I took at Tenterden Town in 2006 of a Metropolitan District Rly coach.

Having just looked at the Bachmann website, the 4-wheel carriages are very 'Brighton' in panelling, general outline and roof profile.
A reasonable LBSC bogie carriage could possibly be made from these bodies.

John.

[IanT]

They are quite close John but the nearest I've seen is the 1st Class Jubilee (No 321) which closely matches the window/panelling layout of the Bachmann coach - although the windows are more square on the original.

Anyone who has a copy can find a photo of it in 'Metropolitan Railway Rolling Stock' by J R Snowden - page 24.

In fact, looking further into Met coaching stock - the 'Bogie Stock' that followed the Jubilee (4 wheeler) and the earlier (8 wheeler) stock was a six compartment unit on 7' bogies. You could probably get two of these carriages out of three Bachmanns (see drawings on pages 30/31 of the Met book if you have it). Another interesting possibility is that some of these bogie coaches were converted to Motor coaches - that had four compartments plus the driver/engine compartments. One Bachmann & some plasticard scratch building perhaps?

I suspect there will be a few variations on the theme once people start looking at it. There certainly seems to be some useful opportunities with the Met coaches (and the other railways where much of this stock ended up).     

[John Candy]

Here is an archive photo of a Met. Jubilee all First

http://basilicafields.wordpress.com/2010/04/06/the-metropolitan-railway-jubilees/

John.

[IanT]

The 'top' panelling is not the same in these photos John.

It seems that the photo I've been looking at is one of the 27 Met Jubilees that were modernised and put back into service in Feb 1909. They had electric lighting and heating installed - "including external panelling in the same style as the bogie stock".

It is this "style" that most resembles the Bachmann coaches. Anyway - I think we've beaten this one well and truely to death. 

Anyone else got any good prototype matches as conversion suggestions? 

[John Candy]

Going back to the LB&SCR carriages which I mentioned earlier, here are a couple of links showing 4-wheel examples:-

http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pics/661.html
http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pic2/stroudley/661_jan02_014_12h.jpg

The LBSC 'all First' bogie stock was of similar pattern and roof outline to the 4-wheelers above.

Below, Metropolitan 'Ashbury' bogie stock, of the type used for early experiments with electric MU traction to which Ian referred earlier:-

http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/bash/index.html
http://www.bluebell-railway.co.uk/bluebell/pics/coach394.html

If one is prepared to accept a measure of compromise, the fact is that the Bachmann coaches could form the basis for a Victorian carriage of almost any railway.

How about a range of etched brass side/end overlays (following the example of 'Comet' in 4mm scale)?

The 'low arc' roof could also be replaced with an elliptical or other profile for certain railways.

I think this subject has now 'wandered' away from the 'wagon' board topic heading under which the original post was made by Mike and that any future posts on carriages should be started as a new thread on the 'Carriages' board under an appropriate topic heading.

This thread is left open for updates on Mike's project to 'kit bash' a 7-plank open.

Regards,
John.

[MikeWilliams]

Thanks John (and Ian).  My troublesome truck is in the post to me at just £36 plus postage, so I look forward to examining it in detail.

Mike

[Andy B]

Awaiting your assessment with interest , Mike.

Back2Bay6 are currently advertising 2 trucks for £65 incl postage.
Anyone know any G-scalers who might want a load of redundant wheelsets??

Andy

[Dave Owen]

Back2bay6 are also selling coaches for £35 each....and there's an interior kit for £9.50....!

[MikeWilliams]

They say that if something seems too cheap it probably is, but it seems I don't learn.

I ordered my Troublesome Truck from Dragon G-Scale's web site, partly because I'd heard of them so assumed they were OK.  Over a week later it hasn't arrived, they are not answering the phone and have not replied to my chasing e-mail.  As they are mainly G-Scale people about which I know nothing, does anyone know of this outfit, please?

Mike

[Markie]

I have ordered stuff from Dragon in the past and have to admit, I have had no probs at all. They are always competitively priced and delivery is spot on usually. I may have an alternative route into them and would be happy to enquire on your behalf in my capacity as Garden Rail Columnist (without wishing to interfere) if that helps and expedites the situation.

Regards,

Markie