Orion Models - no longer doing Gauge 3

[Moonraker]

Talking of non-renewals of memberships, a possible reason is that you make renewal so difficult. Renewal forms arrive by snail mail and have to be posted back. The only methods of payment are cheque or postal order. This is the 21st century guys. I, like many people, don't have a cheque book any more because all payments are done over the internet.

Okay, I accept that there are many Gauge 3 members who probably prefer the old ways. However, that shouldn't stop you from catering for junior 68 year olds like me with electronic renewals and save the society some money at the same time. All you have to do is to email the non-renewals a renewal request and let us pay by Paypal.

By the way, I have no idea whether I have renewed my membership or not. I certainly want to be a member. Can anyone tell me if I am a current member, please?

Regards
Peter Lucas

[AllWight]

What about the "cheque book modellers", such as those who model LGB 45mm gauge where the size is the same only the abilities vary as to what they are willing to create themselves.

If we get a new member from the LGB scale/guage what is there to keep him/her interested in the G3S and gauge 3 scale?

Mark

[IanT]

Well I'm not sure why you should find my comment so offensive John but if you did, please accept my apologies - I merely stated my opinion on the matter.

My view may be simplistic but if you can drill a hole in (or cut up) wood to that level of competence then I personally don't see too much of a challenge in doing the same simple kind of task in a piece of brass. The work required to complete a simple mechanical version of the Society's Bogie would not require a lathe (hand drill, file and a hacksaw would probably do it) and could be tackled by most people I would suggest - most especially if some local advice and support were available. Hence my belief in local groups.

The question of "availability of product" (whether from the Society or not) has been raised many times over the years. I think it was much more of a concern 10-12 years ago but really should be much less so today.

Looking in the last Newsletter, we had announcements of:

* An 'Aster' quality Kingscale Britannia (for slightly less money than the most recent Aster equivalent)
* Andy B's Midland covered goods
* Custom Carriages LMS Stanier corrider 3rd
* Williams Models GER 10t brake & LNWR D88 van (with a GER 5-plank to follow) and the Manning Wardle L Class loco kit
* New Walsall kits for a GWR Macaw 45ft bogie, LMS 24ft Brake, LNWR 42ft arc carriages and new wheelsets in turned steel
* GRS had their pre-release SR Mogul loco kit and their recently released LNER suburban carriages
* Peter Wood has his laser cut parts including the Saxa Salt wagon
* (not mentioned) but Slater's have their new Midlands van coming along

So whilst I would like to see more lots more G3 product (and I certainly expect to do so) I also feel there is ample evidence that the 'Trade' is actually pretty active in G3 and frankly I have no wish to try and compete with them nor do I believe that the Society has the resources (primarily the energy and effort) to effectively do so.

There are things we can do to try to encourage the 'Trade' to get involved with 'G3' and indeed we did this with the Signal Arms last year. I'd be delighted to look at any suggestions for other items where we could perhaps help other Traders get into our gauge. But please understand we have finite resources and they need to be spent wisely. 

I'm afraid there will always be a large range of differing views on this topic and the Committee frequently discuss this subject (it's happened many times over the years). Unfortunately there are no easy answers to some of these issues - although it is clear to me that the problems in this area have eased very considerable over the years. I think time will further improve the situation - but I would very much urge you all to look at what you can do to support and encourage new members.

This area was discussed (yesterday) at the latest Committee Meeting and a number of things were suggested for further investigation.

Regards,

Ian T     

[IanT]

Hi Peter,

No, I'm afraid you have not renewed (thus far).

As for payment - we have accepted PayPal payment for several years now - just contact Roger (Treasurer) and he will advise you how to do so.

Regards,


Ian T

[John Candy]

Gentlemen,

I would remind you that there is a "Private" section (i.e. to which G3 Society Members only have access) to this forum, which is where any "dirty washing" should be "aired" in relation to the activities of the G3S.
This thread (which has by now veered well "off-topic") would probably be better split and transferred to the appropriate board.
I have not done so at this stage, since our Moderator is involved in the thread and I am happy to leave that to his judgement.

John Candy

[IanT]

Cheque Book Modellers Mark?

Well I guess the new 'Britannia' would certainly quailfy but maybe you were thinking of people with smaller chequebooks? I don't see demand for that sort of product getting anywhere near to the level that a large commercial producer (such as Bachmann for example) would get interested.

It's not just the Gauge - it also the lack of a global market for such (UK prototype) products. The US want US-type prototypes and LGB were very much US/European in nature. And 2 1/2" gauge doesn't really exist in those markets - it's mostly 45mm.

So for CBM's the only RTR solution is likely to be higher-end companies (in terms of cost - e.g. Aster-like) such as Kingscsale or indivduals who will take commissions to either scratch-build (still expenive) or to complete existing kits (slightly less expensive) - such as Mikes Manning Wardle (or Venture) for example.

Regards,

Ian T

PS The sun's shining and the Shed is calling.   

[cabbage]

1: I was the person who "translated" the original drawing for the G3S bogie (it was a mish mash of imperial and metric) -possibly I should be to blame for it?

2: I am also the person who persuaded the G3S to use PayPal -so possibly I should be held to task for that???

Having "spoken" to several other scratch builders across the globe, it seems to be that Gauge '3' gets confused with 3 1/2 inch gauge -but "Spur II" is understood instantly...

"Chequebook Modellers" are a group area of "Gauge 1" and "O Gauge" -I don't think that they will every occur in "Gauge '3' "... The only method of doing it would be an "instalment plan" like Maxitrak have for their 5 inch locos -I would have bought their Sentinel kit -but I have no where to run it... My Late father left me enough money to buy myself a lathe and a mill -so I never touched either of them until my early fifties. I never did metal work at school, far rather preferring wood work, hence the reason my locos start out as wooden frames -but then so does my moggie....

Is there a limited market for UK prototypes -I would definately agree. My friend "Thorsten" in Sweden bemoans the fact that if anyone is going to a model a "Troll Puller" (a TVOJ steam turbine locomotive) it is going to have to be him as there was no possible way it could ever be commercially made. I have a similar problem.

I went to school on a train pulled by Class 15a.

Would I like one in my collection -you bet!!! But it could never be a Gauge '3' loco...

"Phillipa" would like  a Class 90a SAR loco -complete with model Vespa for inspecting the long train of ore wagons -but with the same problem.

If the G3S limits itself to UK prototypes then it inherently cuts down its membership. I model US, Indian, and UK locos. Most of them are electric -because I like "Sparkies". I am experimenting with "Live Diesel" (1 and "in bits" locos) and soon(ish) "Live Gas Turbine". The G3 loading gauge encompases all the main loading gauges except the Russian and Chinese one and before anyone starts I do know that the US is a 1/4 inch (full scale) too bit -but this means the model is 0.011 inches too wide. I think I have applied thicker coats of paint...

I think that the majority of the G3 builders are going to accept that the manufacturers are in the main going to supply carriages and wagons. Locos will be few and far between. This means it is never going to be cheap. the low number of G3 users also means that the market cannot achieve the "snowball" point -let alone the "tipping point".

regards

ralph

[MikeWilliams]

This topic has indeed strayed off track and I apologies if my original posting prompted that in some way.  I merely wished to point out that Orion won't be doing G3 afterall and their stated reasons.  Whether you believe their reasons is another matter - I don't as I believe the support for Gauge 3 is growing all the time.

I'm sure the subsequent comments and suggestions gave our committee plenty to discuss and consider!

Mike

[John Witts]

Hello All

Ralph, there is no need for you to take the blame for the bogie, I am talking about a simple proven design that works, it was not your design idea.
I see no point in continuing this thread, the people that should be considering the comments have shown themselves to have closed minds.
I have no wish to see this sensable discussion deteriorate any further.

John

[IanT]

I absolutely agree with you John - no point at all.

And why not look on the bright side for a change, after February you certainly won't have to put up with me (and my obvious limitations) any more.

Oh, by the way, I'm not sure that the people who put their time and effort (and I wasn't one of them by the way) into getting the Society 'Bogies' made availabe for the Membership would quite appreciate their efforts being called "half-baked". You know how quick some people are to take offence these days?   

Regards,

Ian T

[AllWight]

Mr Chairman

Please do not try and martyr yourself in that underhand tone. It shows a lack of humility. You would have been better off saying nothing and letting the topic cease. The closed minds comment, brutal though it may be is in some instances apt. You should learn to take the rough with the smooth and not be too quick to react all the time. This is as John Candy says in the public domain and an outsider reading your comments might think very lowly of you and the G3S.

I will make no further comments on these issues.

Mark   

[IanT]

You are quite right Mark

(As Chairman) I should have sat here and said nothing. I have actually managed to do that quite a lot over recent years. But you know what they say.   A moment of pleasure - A lifetime of regret.

As penance I will take myself hence and never darken this electronic doorstep with my postings again.

Regards,

Ian T

 

[MikeWilliams]

Gentlemen - please cease this thread.

I started this topic with an innocent report about Orion, but it has degenerated and resulted in two active members saying they won't take part again.  That has achieved nothing at all.

However, as John Candy said, there is a section of the forum for internal squabbles and I urge those with comments to make to use it.  G3S members and G3 modellers can benefit from your comments, suggestions and even more so your offers to help, so we need you to continue on the forum, but not in this public string.

This forum is a wonderful tool and asset to G3 modellers, so please nobody turn your back on it.  Take a few minutes to look back at some of the really useful posts there have been, and continue with the positive contribution ALL those on this thread have made in their own way to our scale.

Perhaps a moderator should lock this thread?

Mike

I agree it is time to terminate this thread.
Ian T has asked to be relieved of the duties of Moderator and Mike Williams has agreed to take on the role.
JC